Scobleizer - Latest Comments in Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Farhan Thawar — Fri, 11 May 2007 16:20:41 -0000

I've also done a demo, but I agree with Scoble that things could be MUCH easier on the UI front. Good job, GMaps!

http://fathawar.spaces.live...

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Peter Laudati — Mon, 16 Apr 2007 12:09:37 -0000

Didn't realize others beat me to the punch, but I posted a screencast over the weekend too.
http://blogs.msdn.com/peter...

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Darren Straight — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 22:28:44 -0000

@Herb: No problem at all.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Steve lombardi — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 11:31:03 -0000

I've posted follow up comments on the VE blog along with some screenshots and commentary.

http://virtualearth.spaces....

One last comment about Brand vs. Tech. Who is the number one online mapping provider- Google? Microsoft? Yahoo? Not by a long shot. It's MapQuest. Why? decide for yourself. is their technology way ahead of their competitors? or is it that they have an established and trusted brand that they have built over the past dozen years?

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Jason B. — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 09:33:01 -0000

Robert, Flikr does own a lot more cool content than Images.live.com. If you have said that you think live images is better than Google Images then I'm sorry and I have a lot more respect (not that you care) for you.

About Google maps, Microsoft is doing a lot innovating and I'm glad you pointed out the weak point, the interface. maybe those guys do need to come over and work but it's an entirely different type of interface.

Also, if you want hi quality images, please see the drop down on live's image search. you can search for only images that are the same size as your desktop (looking for wallpaper) I can find all types of images that are 2560x1600. I have about 5 gigs of great things I've found on Images.live.com I can search for any resolution of photo I want, 1920x1200 (True HD) is a popular format.

What I'd like to see is the indexes of all the majors and the interfaces become seperate services. If I like Microsoft's patented infinite scroll to search google index, I think all consumers would be happy if these different services were seperated. But then we get back to the photobucket-myspace trama.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 21:11:05 -0000

For instance, go to http://images.live.com and search for "Soccer." Then go to Flickr and do the same search. Flickr is faster (at least on Firefox on my Mac) and has better quality images (at least to my opinion).

But, you are right. On this Microsoft is better than Google and does have a better interface.

Maybe the image search team needs to overhaul the Maps user experience?

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 21:08:16 -0000

Jason: I talked about Live.com's Image Search a while back. It is pretty cool.

But Flickr's search does a lot better for the times I've searched for images.

I also don't do many image searches. Thomas Hawk would be a better one to ask about that than me.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Jason B. — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 21:01:05 -0000

Actually, it has more to do with fandom. People don't call the shots as they see them. I've never heard Robert even so much as mention how much cooler images.live.com is than images.google.com. Never, not once. I could be wrong but I see through a lot of things and most people don't want to give Microsoft the credit they deserve when they actually do deserve it.

My 2C

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Micah — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 20:04:08 -0000

Glad to hear you understand it now!

To be honest I'm not fully sure why they call it scratch pad, probably because it does more than just collections. Probably because it's more than just a collections window.

Thanks for the debate, I think I'll stick with maps.live.com.

I guess I like more functionality in the applications I use, which naturally leads to a more hefty interface.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 19:06:25 -0000

Weird. So today saving collections and opening them back up works.

Oh, I realize why I didn't see them. It saved them in a down-arrow menu -- my birthplace was saved under "Half Moon Bay" for instance. That's wrong. And makes me feel stupid. Damn, I had no idea that's where collections were being saved. Google doesn't use down arrow menus so I always saw what I had saved.

And, why save collections in a menu called "Scratch pad?" That confused me too.

Micah, I've just decided you're smarter than me. I'll stick with Google, thanks.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Micah — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 18:35:13 -0000

For those of you who do not have Soapbox accounts you can go here instead:
http://www.metacafe.com/wat...

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Micah — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 17:19:35 -0000

I agree with Mr. Robinson, I was suprised at the lack of comments about my post by Scoble.

I don't remember every saying I was trying to convince anyone, I was just stating a fact that the site is not that difficult to use if you seriously try and use it like every other site that exists.

But, Scoble has requested a video on how to save a collection so here is a link (note I am already signed into my Live Account, didn't want login while taping it) unfortunatly it's been compressed like crazy, if you have a place I can upload the orginal I'd be happy to do so:
http://soapbox.msn.com/vide...

Scoble your site alone as 9 main links on it, not to mention that they are horribly placed for an ease of use factor plus it's stuffed between a bunch of random stuff that pretty much all blends into each other, your commenting on posts is a nightmare: "paging" it's a great thing, we'll like it.

Obviously you don't claim to be a great designer or usability expert, but yet it seems if commenting on usability of other sites and saying they do a weak job, should mean your site would at least be a bit better.

I think it really comes down to branding for Microsoft, I don't think what they are doing is work, pretty much across the board. I don't know what they could do to be better unless I worked for them and had all the research and data needed to make an appropriate evaluation as what needs to be done.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Michael Markman (Mickeleh) — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 14:34:49 -0000

Or is it Spider Man?

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Michael Markman (Mickeleh) — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 14:34:15 -0000

@71. Halo2 didn't get lines of early adopters on Microsoft's brand equity. It earned them with Halo brand equity. (People aren't going to line up to see Spiderman 3 because it comes from Sony Pictures. They're going to line up because they like the Spiderman franchise.)

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Michael Markman (Mickeleh) — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 14:23:57 -0000

@73. @67. You and Scoble are both right. Think of brand as a bank account. Every good product builds up the brand account. Every bad product is a withdrawal. If your brand equity is very strong, people will sample even shitty products. But at the same time, your equity drops a bit. Or, if you like physics better than accounting, think of a brand as a fly-wheel that stores kinetic energy. Same deal. Enough shitty products and the brand rolls to a dead stop.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 02:11:04 -0000

Mr. Robinson: why don't you record a video showing me how to save a collection? I just tried it again and can't figure out how to save one and how to open it up again. Maybe I am an idiot. But no one has taken the time to show me how to do it.

Until you or Micah demonstrates that to me, then why should I listen to you? I've tried it four times so far on two different OS's and both IE and Firefox. I can't figure out how to get it to work, while Google's works much simpler.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Mr. Robinson — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 00:38:05 -0000

Welch, you're a joke. If Apple had come up with the Office 2007 interface, you'd be praising it to the high heavens. Tell me if I'm wrong (but be honses with yourself first).

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Mr. Robinson — Thu, 12 Apr 2007 00:36:45 -0000

"Micah: sorry, you aren’t convincing anyone."

Wait, that's your entire response to all the points Micah made? Sorry, Scoble, but that response brings to mind the scene in Planet of the Apes, where the simian judges place their hands over their eyes and ears because they don't even want to *hear* any opposing argument. What the hell is the use of responding to your posts if you just dismiss them with "Sorry, you're not convincing anyone" without even bothering to address the points made?

You have your head so far up Google's posterior that you can hardly think straight. The reason one of the posters above used Caps-Lock is that it seems to be the only way to get anything through your thick skull.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Alijah Green — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:54:55 -0000

No you are blind. you mention nothing of the other tabs on googles page layout and making it seem as if local live collections is broke absolutly false.
Its sad when you are not telling the real fact that google has copied (and improved) every last feature that virtual earth team has every came up with. Starting with the Hybrid button that was first seen during your own recording with the team during you days at channel 9. But did you point the finger no you let the fanboys parade as if it was there own. I remember how ecstatic your were to see this feature for the first time. But really to address cap locks instead of seeing where you are wrong at is so very child like of you John C Welch must be rubbing off on you.

ps there nothing wrong with cap locks if there is one were is keyboard 2.0 at.
thanks and god bless you

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

John C. Welch — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 22:43:57 -0000

“When has Microsoft ever tried to make the UI simpler while still providing solid functionality?”

Office 2k7?
Took me all of 0.2 seconds to think of that.
Try harder next time, Welch.

Snerk. YOu have a very funny definition of "simpler". "More obvious" and "Simpler" are not the same things. That would be why they are different words

PS DID YOU MAKE SURE THAT YOU WERE SIGN IN WHILE USING LOCAL LIVE.

FISHSTICKS!!!!!!

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Carlos — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 18:21:18 -0000

I said this when Virtual Earth came out and it's still true... Microsoft's maps suck because they are old and are in black and white. Over 90% of the US is black and white once you get to within 1 mile. The world is bigger than Redmond, Washington. Useless. Google Maps has quality control and that's why people like it better.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 15:17:17 -0000

Alijah: the fact that you leave the caps lock key on demonstrates that you probably love hard to use interfaces too.

If you think Google and Virtual Earth have the same layouts then you aren't looking hard enough.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Alijah Green — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 15:12:53 -0000

"And Google has two tabs up top: 1) Search Results 2) My Maps.

Microsoft, on the other hand, has 1) Welcome 2) Collections 3) Driving directions 4) Traffic 5) Locate me 6) Share 7) Print"

FOR SOME REASON YOU HAVE OVERLOOKED THE FACT THAT GOOGLE MAPS HAS JUST ABOUT THE SAME LAYOUT AS LOCAL LIVE. AND GOOGLE TABS ARE AS FOLLOWS 1) SEARCH RESULTS 2) MY MAPS 3) TRAFFIC 4)MAP 5)SATELLITE 6) HYBRID 7)SEARCH THE MAP 8)FIND BUSINESSES 9)GET DIRECTIONS. THE SEARCH BOX IS BUILT UP WITH 5 AJAX BOXES THAT CHANGE WHEN CLICK UPON (7)SEARCH THE MAP 8)FIND BUSINESSES 9)GET DIRECTIONS).

PS DID YOU MAKE SURE THAT YOU WERE SIGN IN WHILE USING LOCAL LIVE.

THIS SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE ABOUT GOOGLE BLOG FANBOYS THEN FEATURE SETS AND UI.

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Robert Scoble — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:43:34 -0000

Peter, yup, but Microsoft has the money to fund some really great user testing sessions. I'll try to point out other things they do well (I usually put a lot of the Virtual Earth's blog stuff on my link blog, by the way).

Re: Why doesn’t Microsoft Maps get the hype?

Peter Laudati — Wed, 11 Apr 2007 14:20:01 -0000

@Scoble – You’re right on virtually all fronts in your post. I don’t think I got the items you mentioned wrong, I just didn’t focus on them. I agree with you on the usability issues. I give Google full kudos for “one-upping” the game with a better user experience in myMaps then Collections. It’s absolutely simpler, more discoverable, and more polished.

The feedback you just provided in your post is priceless. It’s exactly what the folks who make Live Maps need to see so that they know how they should improve their product. (FWIW, I’ve experienced some of the same issues too!)

But here’s the rub… and this is a chicken and egg problem. If people don’t know that Live Maps exists in the first place, they’ll never use it. If they’re not using it, then they can’t provide the crucial feedback needed to the product team to improve it. A lot of the reaction to Google’s myMaps was “This is cool because it’s a new feature that no one has seen before.” And that was my point in the post, LM has had collections for some time now, but no one knew about it.

Thanks to your post for bringing attention to the usability issues. If, as a result of either of our posts, people try out LM collections and raise that same feedback to the product team, then I think we accomplished something here. Steve from the product team already commented earlier that he’s listening. That's cool!
-Peter (aka JrzyShr Dev Guy)