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Oh and though I have no idea of the numbers remember that Yahoo offers paid-for email accounts.
Gmail provides both POP and IMAP access, as well as a POP fetcher to vacuum your mail out of another service into gmail. I was on the phone with microsoft support asking how I could get these emails out of a service grandma has paid for every month for over eight years. They basically told me I couldn't, and to go pound sand.
They have no respect for their users' ownership of their data, whereas Google does. This is an example of how Google is open and Microsoft isn't, and shows plainly that Microsoft doesn't give a shit about their users.
I suspect also that this general attitude and culture at Microsoft is a large part of the reason that geeks, including Jerry Yang, don't like them, wouldn't want to join them, and would rather take less money to do a deal with someone else.
---High school sophomore.
Unless Microsoft decides to reduce confusion by killing off it's own products in the mean time, it will be next summer at the very earliest before the first Microsoft or Yahoo product is rebranded.
Charlie: see http://googlesystem.blogspot.com/2008/01/import...
I agree with everything you say except that statement. Microsoft's consumer offerings integrate wonderfully well at http://home.live.com. That's one thing that Microsoft are doing right.
Note I'm not talking about the quality of the services themselves, I'm saying that they integrate better than anyone else's - that's all.
-Jamie
I really don't understand this attitude. I know of only one company that provides an API that allows their customers to share their list of contacts/friends/whatever with ABSOLUTELY ANY THIRD PARTY without requiring that customer to give up their username/password to the third party. Go and search for "Live Contacts API" if you don't believe me.
The person who posted the above quote also says Microsoft don't provide POP support for hotmail. That is utter rubbish as well.
Give some credit where credit is due please. Or at least don't discredit where it is NOT due.
-Jamie
Your e-mail data is extremely valuable for personalized search. Having your e-mail integrated with your search provider allows search to be contextualized based on your current or recent e-mails, tasks, and your contact list (friends).
One example would be the ability to click on a named-entity within your e-mail and have it execute a personalized web search based on your interests and those of your contact list.
Really, Robert; an email from Google to Microsoft?
And yet you don't link to such an email (from Google to Microsoft)?
That bit of major inaccurate reporting just cratered the rest of your follow-through.
Hire a proof-reader, kid.
There is a blog post from David Drummond with Google Legal -- to the reading public:
http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2008/02/yahoo-an...
And there are reports of a benevolent phone call from Schmidt to Yang.
But where are the reports of an email from Google to Microsoft?
I would be kinda fun to see such an email presented to regulators, no?
If they can pull it off that yahoo outsources it's search, they should thank Microsoft even more...
Regarding email, that's quickly becoming old fashioned, look at the youngsters they hardly use email anymore. IM is hotter, but there's less possibility for adds or getting people to use it for search.
If i look at the mobile offerings, Microsoft is relying to hard on their own technology, while most mobiles don't talk their language.
To your points....
1) Seriously, Robert, Google does mind. Nope, two turkeys don't make an eagle, but having those turkeys fight against each other rather than just one that pecks at you is still better.
2) Sure, Google wins in the short term. But what, you think that this is somehow something they were hoping for? Don't get you here and what relevance this has.
3) So what if IM and email are harder to monetize. Google doesn't want these two kids to get together and knows that pushing back on letting them have greater dominance in particular products may work as well for them in stopping the deal as is did for Microsoft giving Google bad PR on the DoubleClick deal.
"I agree with everything you say except that statement. Microsoft’s consumer offerings integrate wonderfully well at http://home.live.com. That’s one thing that Microsoft are doing right."
Except, except.... "Problem loading page". Can't be anything to do with using Firefox can it? Nah. (Goes to look up a definition of "integrate").
something is being missed for sure
My concerns are these things will delay the innovations and the cash flow in the valley.
I encourage you to read my post and see if we *bloggers get it* or not before you call us all nuts.
From my view point, Microsoft is going after the new internets - this includes mobile but extends to your car, tv, living room (gaming) and more. These are the new internets and no one has a lock on it yet.
Free, ad-driven, Wifi\WiMax\whatever based GPhone...
http://peterdawson.blogspot.com/2008/02/jerry-y...
there were 61 million Chinese mobile search users in 2007. This year, that number is expected to rise to 117 million (ref - iResearch). US search engine advertising spending in 2007 is $8.6 billion And spending nearly doubling to almost $16.6 billion in 2011 (ref – eMarketer).
I guess, the real race is for search (both in mobile/pc)
So... what is this all about? I agree with the delay tactics mentioned above. But I also think this is about Google costing Microsoft BILLIONS of additional dollars. If Google can offer a great ad deal to Yahoo, all of a sudden Microsoft's offer is less attractive. Yup... Microsoft will need to pony up BILLIONS more to make this happen. That is what it is all about, and it is BRILLIANT! Google is one damn smart company.
Three points...
Sticky. email and IM are always-on products. You want people to come back to your site? It takes an intervention (and you should know) to keep people from checking daily, if not hourly.
Mobile. email and IM are migrating nicely to mobile (pronounced blackberry). If you want to take your brand, and your customers, onto mobile platforms, compulsive checking and all, then you want active, compelling email and IM.
Presence. Contextual presence hasn't filtered its way into many social applications yet. But you can see how sharing your availability might improve your experiences on a dating site, a sports forum, or job search. In the mobile world, presence triggers conversation, and talk pays.
Great post.
- Phil
If your analysis hasnt mentioned Windows or Office in a discussion about microsoft's biggest ever bet, then your probably not following the money.
There is still a very strong motivation to start daily information consumption cycle with email (yes sometimes before morning leak!). Any idea how much money Google makes every time you open Gmail? Nobody wakes up in the morning to go and hit Google for search. There is no motivation there. Email brings motivation.
Also users read their email slowly (read more attention to whatever ad you might have on sidebars) , whereas on search pages/content sites we all become scroll monkeys. This is an important distinction and will become important as marketers draw user attention graph and place their budget accordingly.
Without email, there will be less motivation for making search queries. Same as first point. If my motivation and context is not overlapping, I will generate less queries. Less search queries for Google means bad news.
Brij
http://tinyurl.com/2cu7db
I have to agree with Danny that you haven't told us what EVERYONE missed. Nice headline, great linkbait, calling out Kara Swisher - good tactic. But what did Kara miss in her very funny take on translating David Drummond's legalese?
This deal is all about sesarch -- paid search, natural search, universal search, local mobile search, social search. Take your pick.
Sure Google's doing mobile deals. They did before the msft bid; they will regardless of its outcome.
BTW, this was funny: "So, every month that Microsoft and Yahoo will be stuck in some courtroom arguing out why this is a good deal means money in the bank for Google as they close mobile phone deal after mobile phone deal"
...because I can almost guarantee that the same people "arguing in courtrooms" wouldn't be the same people writing code or making mobile deals :) Ah well.
We all know that it is their intent to create an Internet monopoly like they created an OS-Monopoly and Office=Software monopoly before. If it can be done or not is another question.
But if—as a result out of this—Google and Yahoo end up as a strategic team, this day might as well go into tech history as Microsoft’s Waterloo.
With nothing left but the “trainwreck” (M. Arrington) that Microsoft has turned its online services into, they will have lost the online battle with Google for as sure as sure can be.
What most people miss about Microsoft: The hostile Yahoo! takeover is already another major blow against their own brand. People are sickened by this kind of Tyrannosaurus Rex attitude. That this comes just one week after MS Ex-CEO Bill Gates “issuing a clarion call for a ‘kinder capitalism’ to aid the world’s poor”speaks volumes.
Point #2 just seemed completely gratuitous and wrongheaded to me.
However, I do agree, that the longer Microhoo takes, the better it is for Google.
BTW, I love the quote in #1.
The only overhead is for coders, hosting and storage, which are a non-negotiable part of almost all web apps.
1) Isn't there a big notion that one's social network resides in email, people whom you email a lot etc. So, maybe email is actually a bigger play than we think. Our darling Facebook has email in its crosshairs
2)Yahoo has been adding mobile partners frequently and is already ahead of Google with 40% subs in Asia! Here is Eric's article on it:
http://www.reuters.com/article/businessNews/idU...
Here is is its status in Latin America:
http://www.reuters.com/article/companyNewsAndPR...
3) IM is big if one thinks what is social really means offline - a huge component of our relationship is synchronous and the more synchronous engagements one has, it shows the depth of a relationship
Curious to hear your thoughts
I think google and yahoo are kindred spirits, they need each other, and they both know microsofts reign is nearly over.
Get a live. The web 2.0 bubble is about to burst.
I think Google simply wants to annoy Microsoft. Microsoft complained about the Doubleclick-acquisition (and they were right with their complaints), now Google complains about the Yahoo! acquisition. (Again, they are right to complain. But it's not Google who has to worry, it's all the smaller competitors.)
I kind of think though that Yahoo will become gobbled up & lose its identity in the merger, becoming Just Another MSN Type Service.
And why is the GC commenting isn't that Erics job ? if I where the GC I would be paying more attention to that age descrimination case thats in the works and making sure i'me not being set up as the fall guy if it all goes pear shaped
There seems to be a suggestion that Microsoft is incapable of two things at once...surely there is nothing to prevent them going after mobile business while the lawyers happily savage each other? Admittedly they have other problems in increasing their share of that market, but I can't honestly see how the Yahoo fiasco ('cos let's be honest, it's pointless) has any bearing on that at all.
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In the end, we will all still use the Internet, email, IM, various services, etc.
So what if MS buys Yahoo. Google will make money, MS/Yahoo will make money. All that seems to matter to the overly rich players is more and more profit.
It boils down to simply money. Again, who cares. The Internet will still work.
mmmm turkey !
The BBC reports: It’s clear the search giant (Google) is determined to stop this deal. “We’re very nervous about it,” a Google insider told me. “Microsoft is so huge it can just hire a couple of thousand engineers at the click of its fingers and put them to work on any problem.”
If we replace Fake Steve Job’s 100-yard dash example with a tug-of-war example, the results change. If we tie the two guys who finished second and third together and ask for a rematch in tug-of-war against the guy who finished first, I would bet on two guys being able to out-pull one guy.
More at my website: www.GstockReport.com
as far as mobile web, you should check out www.quobile.com. it's a site for mobile phones that takes out all the stuff you don't need and works faster than any others. it also has blogs and local news optimized for mobile.
I totally agree that the next big game is in mobile. (See my post Static on the Dream Phone, in which I complain that the NYT took out the most important line from my op ed, namely that Google's mobile initiatives are their most strategic.)
And Microsoft also has some credible strategic focus there. But if they were really thinking that way, they ought to be acquiring Adobe, because Flash is also getting big traction on mobile. Meanwhile, I thought that the suggestion that Nokia ought to get into the running for Yahoo! was intriguing.
I imagine your comments about email were partly a response to my piece Yahoo! Plus Microsoft Strategic Assets in Email. This was not to say that mobile was not important, just that it would be easy for Microsoft to miss some real strategic assets they might be acquiring.
But more to the point, it seems to me that email and IM are still under-rated applications. Just as in 1998, no one thought search would be monetizable, now people are ignoring communications applications. And so the applications languish. There's been little real advance for years. I believe that the company that pays real attention to adding value to these applications, making them much more useful for their customers, will reap real benefits. Just as Google didn't start out with a monetization model for search, but just figured they could do a better job for users (and even when they did turn to monetization, just focused on how advertising could be better for users, not better for them), someone needs to rethink email and IM with a real focus on the customer value proposition.
We're all dealing with email overload. Meanwhile, social networking has given us new ideas for how to filter, manage, and exploit our connections. Smart entrepreneurs are building new value here. Why can't the big guys spend some time on customer value rather than shareholder value?
you nailed it but what the entire tech industry and amazon - yahoo -microsoft and google +ibm
are missing is one single point what will happen when a terminator like scenario really happens-you can see it happenning already-but you aint seen nothing yet
when mobile phones and all could be used to control anything what if say a angry microhoo employee or ex-employee or say gogol want to wreck havoc -we already saw that last few weeks due to the undersea cable cut- lets say sabotage-what will we as humans do
sorry my friend - the foundation for a company is people money and time-if 1 guy has enough money and enough time he can do a lot which no one can notice and will notice after a long time- like say the french banker
the basis for tech is money - and people - if these 2 go away or are squandered then no matter what happens life will turn into a bunch of pulp and not electronics -no where in recorded history have people talked of electronics or others except when they say it -they talk of it as evil
scoble - i ask you to listen to your heart and wonder if and when a robotic future comes - the people who shall survive are the ones who can connect with nature-this is something that the mayan civilisation had forecasted and so did a bishop some centuries back who said the names of all the popes and then said the current popes name and then uttered -
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes
(In extreme persecution, the seat of the Holy Roman Church will be occupied by Peter the Roman, who will feed the sheep through many tribulations; when they are over, the city of seven hills will be destroyed, and the terrible or fearsome Judge will judge his people. The End.)
there is one temple said to be revered all over the world and one which is on the top of seven hills
i know bill gates will read this and say maybe i was wrong in making a move against yahoo for the next few sentences shall send a shiver to everyone
the temple of lord balaji is said to be on top of seven hills -thus making it the richest hindu place of worship much more than any other place and second only to the church
the hills that adorn it are said to be that of a snake called adisesha - a snake on which the lord vishnu - adorns
and i astrologically am said to be that of the yoga of ashlesha or the serpent yoga {bill gates i know has many a raja yoga like me and can do whatever he wants - i know because i read his chart)
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He is closely associated with Vishnu. His name means "that which remains", from the Sanskrit root shiş, because when the world is destroyed at the end of the kalpa, Shesha remains as he is.
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source -http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adisesha
i had known these since 2002 and i had waited and scoble many can see the next few moves - i can as i write know whether i am doing a good or bad move because of my eyes and the distance between the eyes to the object -its a gift that i have learnt to live with
even my enemy with a million $ in hand =not you bill = wants to kill me and has tried to do that a million times but i have some how managed to escape him
how much does he hate - he hates me enough to hire people who work across the road just to monitor and kill me-how much does the prize he seeks wants me - enough to tell her family that she will not marry anyone else but me despite the battle going on for 6 long years-what is the war all about - a silly thing called love perfect for valentines day but true - i havent seen her for 6 years and she has 'i think' seen me =we dont talk on the phone =we dont call each other-we dont sms -we dont know how this war will end
yet we dont give up on each other yet we love each other and we will each be ready to give the world away for each other
my enemy and i have not even met once during these 6 years yet i know each and every move he makes
and he knows mine also and my oh my sadly these moves are being made on yahoo - = too much of a coincidence though.after all a book with my name as the title is with own media network - to be launched in 2009 and had recieved the book on jan 30 th and the offer was proposed i believe on feb 2nd-too many coincidences
also one more part-google offering a team edition of apps on feb 4 th -too many -after all i only mentioned one persons name in the book the rest vaguely - bill gates -chairman of microsoft - the rest were in riddles and normal words-thats why the book was never highlighted in the media
and i know you are going to delete this comment - say hi to milan
bye
@runb@laj!
thanks dear scoble -one of few places where i can write freely and express -read below for some of the most shocking stuff that i found when i started this
http://therealnews.freehostia.com/wordpress/200...
Get rich computer Ebooks from Http://computer.Ebooktops.com
Thanks