Scobleizer - Latest Comments in Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

jon — Thu, 12 Nov 2009 04:16:16 -0000

I CAN control my own lists, though, and even when I do my own lists I leave myself off of most of them. That does NOT make me feel bad.
:)))

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Cathy — Sun, 08 Nov 2009 15:24:29 -0000

Love your comments. I agree. We can't all be listed...but it would be nice if everyone in the world would notice us or at least the important people.
Thanks for your post. It was great

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Joe Schmitt — Tue, 03 Nov 2009 17:24:04 -0000

Unfortunately following people does not always mean "I actually have them in my twitterstream". Plenty of people who follow 100 or more people use tools like HootSuite or TweetDeck that allow them to organize who they follow and basically ignore some people or groups of people since they don't use their uncategorized stream any more. Since I'm a big phone user, those tools never appealed to me, and so I've found other ways to achieve the same thing, mostly through multiple accounts.

Even so, we don't give the same attention to everyone in our streams. We all have favorites, people we'll go back for, and people who when we see them in our stream we pay attention. @hotdogsladies said at SXSW that people pay you with their attention if nothing else as a way to tell people not to rush to monetize their blogs or Twitter streams. I still stick to that. I know that some people who follow me barely notice, but others are very engaged.

The rush to measure all this stuff is short-sighted. Those things are helpful, but they don't do a good job of gauging influence.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Mike Kirkeberg — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:41:27 -0000

I do agree with you there. I like Twitter, but don't have time trying to think of mundane crap to put on the timeline. I look there to occasionally be inspired, sometimes to laugh, and to connect with like (and not so like) minded people. I like ideas and opinions, not tuna sandwiches.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Mike Kirkeberg — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 18:37:42 -0000

Hey, Robert,
I am taking a wait and see attitude about the lists, mainly because I don't quite know what they are yet. So far, I don;t think they are evil or anything. Time will form my opinion, as will understanding.
mk

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Rebecca Bardess — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 17:01:38 -0000

Hi. Sorry to butt in but I feel I need to make a little point or two. It's to everyone generally but I read this far and it seemed a good place to put it.

I have huge respect for both Chris and Robert and this is just a difference of opinion not a personal attack. The two of them see things differently and express things differently. I highly doubt this would dent the respect Chris has for Robert or even offend him since one of the qualities he admires - and has even written about - is Robert's honesty. Fans of Chris will understand this and not feel the need to lay into someone he respects, I'm sure. Personally, I think it's healthy for two intelligent and experienced people to express differing opinions because it opens up the conversation. People can disagree and even throw a few currant buns at each other and still respect each other. It's not a soap opera.

There's been a great debate about all aspects of this on Twitter today sparked off by these different views and I can see validity in both of them so it's a shame to view it as a 'pissing contest' because - well - it's just not. It's probably more healthy to get onto twitter, build some lists of your own, have a few thoughts about the possible social ramifications and then blog about it. The more voices that are out there expressing opinions the better. The Bluebird of Guilt is just an annoying budgie at this point. The secret is out. Everyone knows about Twitter Lists, so why don't we all engage in discussing how they are changing things and how we can use that?

In terms of Robert's list-building, I was also involved in the first BETA testing group and it was a blank sheet. While the majority of us were rushing around trying to work out the best ways to use the new tools and set up the theme park before the customers arrived, Robert was totally focused. He knew exactly how he wanted to use Lists and put way more work into this than anyone else I observed in the original team. I think that earns him the right to express an opinion.

From my perspective, I don't consider myself an expert on lists. I seem to come at them from a different perspective to most. My focus was to make lists that people would find useful because I was aware that we were setting everything up. My view hasn't changed now everyone's arrived. For that reason, I don't get bugged at all for being 'excluded' from lists because that wasn't my consideration in the first place. It's always nice to be listed but I'm more bothered by lists of mine that nobody is interested in following. These tend to be the lists I haven't finished building yet so the content needs work. Sometimes I delete the unpopular ones but some of them make sense to me anyhow so they stay. For instance, I have one list that nobody follows but I add my favourite tweeter to it every day. To me, this is growing into a great list so I don't care how others feel about it because in a month or so they'll cotton on to how fab it is. Also, often the people I add to this list as my 'tweeter de jour' are really happy to be a featured person on that day and that matters enough that I couldn't care less how many people follow it.

Anyway, I'm rambling now so I'll round up my points. In summary: Chris=good , Robert=good , open discussion=good . It's all good. That's just about all I have to say about that. If you want to disagree, find me on twitter. Don't throw currant buns though: I'm allergic to currants.

List Robert. List Chris. Enjoy lists. :)

Rebecca

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Kimberly Tsao — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 16:58:44 -0000

I don't get the Twitter lists yet. I certainly don't feel elated that I'm only on one Twitter list , but I'm relatively new to Twitter.

P.S. I'm glad I found your blog. I'm an SJSU alumna so it's good to see successful grads. When I was in Professor Buchwitz's class, I attended the talk you gave.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Sarah Mette — Mon, 02 Nov 2009 09:50:38 -0000

Agreed! I am with you. I think if anything it is a compliment to see what list you fall on and if you think you should be in another list - get goals & start working towards that! You want to be on the great golf list - get on your game. This isn't something where everybody gets a trophy. Either you do something & people recognize & value it, or you don't.
BTW - I think you might make my 'ppl to learn from list'

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

chrislawson — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 21:57:33 -0000

So why was Mr. Scoble so concerned about being excluded from a list of the "Top 100 Twitter Users" posted on The Bivings Report? Why did Mr. Scoble feel so hurt that he bothered to post the following:
"Your list is incomplete. My account has 2400+ listings and should be on this list. I never have been on the Suggested User List, by the way, unlike most of these."
It's just a list. Was he hurt that he wasn't included? Look at how many times HIS account is listed (he bothers to tell us). Was Mr Scobles' "Feely" in need of a little "Touchy"?

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Lucretia M Pruitt — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:27:17 -0000

Makes sense... but think about all the time we're going to have to invest in maintaining these lists. I'd rather spend that time interacting with people. It's why I've never really managed to twig to the groups feature on 3d party apps - I just don't want to spend the time updating/maintaining them when I could be twittering! :)

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Lucretia M Pruitt — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 19:25:15 -0000

I think I get that.

You know, before I got rid of them yesterday, you were the first person I added to my "People Who Make Me Think" list. You're still top of that list, even if it's not a formal "list" on Twitter any more.
I may not always agree with your conclusions but I do always find that you make me examine my own perspective and analysis and that more often than not, you add to my awareness.

I'm very honored to be on your follow list Robert, but I'm even more fortunate to follow you. You're the one who originally made me see the power of twitter and who you follow being more important than who follows you. I've learned a lot thanks to you the past couple of years.

Thanks Robert!

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

dj adelaide — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 18:44:26 -0000

i like how lists have been made public but at the same time they are personalised based on who has created the lists, this cuts out a lot of the work in finding great people to follow

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Anonymous — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:54:09 -0000

While I agree with what you wrote here Robert, you and Chris sure know how to have a conversation about nothing in particular :)

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Ari Herzog — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 13:50:43 -0000

If the argument is subjective, why add to it?

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

rlux — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:57:02 -0000

I have only made three lists so far, and all are categories with objective criteria (eg, women in tech, Adobe staff). I was thinking about making a 4th list called "friends" to make checking in on my closest friends easier but out of concern that excluding people from it might piss them off, I'm keeping that one on Tweetdeck where nobody can see it.

So while in theory I agree with you that people shouldn't be upset by being left off lists, Robert, in reality I'm using lists in a way that's less likely to cause hurt feelings. I guess that means I've got one foot in both camps. :)

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Sara Lancaster — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:27:33 -0000

Think organization tool, not popularity contest.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

chrislawson — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:25:37 -0000

Did you feel bad that you were left off that Top 100 Twitter User List posted on "the Bivings Report". It seemed to bother you enough to post this comment:
"Your list is incomplete. My account has 2400+ listings and should be on this list. I never have been on the Suggested User List, by the way, unlike most of these."
Sucks being left off a list, doesn't it? Life's not fair, right?
"I can’t STAND this attitude that everyone should be included in everything."
Yeah, me neither...
http://www.bivingsreport.com/

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

freeipod — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:11:54 -0000

Have used Twitter in the past but not now :(
I don't find the lists helpful OR useful :(

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Scobleizer — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 12:08:26 -0000

You should follow http://twitter.com/Scobleiz... -- no mess, no fuss. Or, even better, http://www.techmeme.com -- you'll get more out of that than following just loudmouth blogs like mine.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

rah — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 10:31:28 -0000

You run your mouth a lot and as a result exceed your allotted "tweeting quota." I used to think you were interesting.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Scobleizer — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 09:57:31 -0000

My lists aren't finished yet and never will be. I aim to have the most complete lists, though, and if you think someone should be on my lists you can DM me.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Scobleizer — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 09:56:30 -0000

Yes, it sort of is an endorsement. I'm making a list of hosting companies and information sources about hosting companies. By putting companies and people there I am endorsing them and when Rackspace makes its list it will be endorsing them in a way. Luckily we have great competitors worth endorsing.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Scobleizer — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 09:54:53 -0000

I'm hurt by people who are faking their inclusion by me more in the long run than if people are honest and leave me off of lists that I don't deserve to be on. Let's be honest, I WILL be hurt that I'm left off of your "best golfers of all time" list. I WOULD love to be on that list. Thing is, I don't deserve to be on it and if you put me on it you'll make your list suck.

That said, you're on my favorite geek mommy list and you are on my most important list: the list of people I follow. I read that first before I read any of my lists. Oh, and I'm not done building lists yet. I'm only about 10% done going through my 12,000 followings.

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

DarthKaul — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 06:40:50 -0000

I think twitter lists are more about people and less about ourselves.. Because these lists helps my readers and your readers to find the interesting persons we defined in categories .. sometimes in multiple categories.. private lists i don't really agree with because it defeats the purpose. And I am not upset at all that I am not included in my own list. I've noticed some popular twitters have included their own names into their own list.. well that i another thing I couldn't agree too. These lists should be the recommendation of people that I think others should follow .. just my two cents :)

Re: Twitter’s lists make Chris Brogan feel bad

Guest — Sun, 01 Nov 2009 05:16:38 -0000

I agree with you Robert, lists are part of our lives. Let's say you are inviting friends for dinner at your home. Are you going to invite all of your friends and acquaintances? Of course not, you make a list. As a host you have the responsibility to entertain your guests and make sure that a meaningful conversation, adding value for all of your guests at that particular dinner, takes place. After all, the food is not the only reason why your guests accept the invitation. Am I offended, because I'm not on each and everybody's guest list? Of course not, because for me the food is not the only reason either.