Scobleizer - Latest Comments in Keeping kids online safe

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Jonathan Sprague — Sat, 06 Jun 2009 14:52:32 -0000

Our company may be of interest to some parents: www.securinu.com

Kind Regards

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Denise Howell — Sat, 14 Feb 2009 13:40:21 -0000

We'll do open DNS eventually, but for now our 5-year-old's perfectly content with Glubble's FireFox-friendly, well laid out, and safe browser: http://glubble.com/ The family social network part of this service is great too.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Molly Antos — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 18:03:28 -0000

InternetSafety.com provides an array of safety features for kids online - their program "Safe Eyes" sends parents text messages to alert them when their child has attempted to access something inappropriate. This leads to more open and honest discussions between parents and children as opposed to just blindly blocking websites with no explanation.

They recently release an application for the iPhone, the only one of its kind, that will protect kids on the go!

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Tim Toron — Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:14:07 -0000

Some people here seem to put in serious efforts to "protect" their kids from outside threads.

I wonder how these people organize their social live. Are they aware that 90% of all real life sex crimes against children are committed by people close to the kids: Family members, friends of the family, teachers ... ??

Yes, we also teach our kids why they shouldn't provide personal information on public web sites, we talk about what might happen to them when they visit disturbing web pages (having ugly dreams for two weeks at least). But at the end this is just part of the normal "get them ready for the world" education.

Its on the same level as teaching them how to cross the street or what to eat and what not. Nothing more, nothing less. Just something what must be done but no reason to panic.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Matt Norton — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:57:21 -0000

Picking up on some of the earlier notes some of you will probably be interested to know that there are software solutions available already to protect children using mobile phones. The general concensus that I've seen from children's charities and child experts is that while there are definite risks to children using mobile phones from a your age the downsides are outweighed by the positives - both safety and convenience. Secondly, it's just unrealistic to think that you'll be able to resist giving your child a mobile phone sooner rather than later - 'you can't duck technology, you have to deal with it!'.

I'm the CEO of an Irish start-up software company (www.sentrywireless.com) that has developed and launched software that helps 'teach children about responsible mobile usage'. We won the title of "Most Innovagtive Mobile Start-up in the Asia Pacific" for it's launch in Singapore. Using a regular mobile phone (none of those kiddy ones that children laugh at) parents are allowed to 'approve the numbers in the phone book with a PIN number. Once they've done this (it takes less than 15 seconds from first touching teh handset to completion) it means that that not only are these the only numbers the child can call or text but also (more importantly?) these are the only people who can contact the child - so only approved people get through and not strangers! (a white list of approved contacts)

James from earlier today (7.24am) I think got it just right in terms of what a good solution should do:

SMART technology should be able to: (allow me to repeat)

1) Have a part to play to help educate children (without taking away the fun)
2) Provide reassurance to parents (by providing them information when there is a problem)
3) And not be spying! (which creates parent/child trust issues).

We think that when the child is young / naive the parent will control the phone tightly. As the child matures and shows that they are more aware they will have freer use of the phone and at some point the parent will give them the PIN number so that they can enter and remove numbers as they choose .. but still be protected from complete strangers. Eventually they will have no controls.

Kidsafe has a parent alert built in so that if the child tries to remove the SIM card and place it in another phone that miught not protect the parent will automatically send an SMS to the parent warning them. It also captures the main details of the blocked calls and text messages which only the parent can see. This allows the parent detect if there might be an issue e.g. they see a strange number trying repeatedly to contact the child late at night.

However, to James third point about NOT spying) it doesn't capture the content of any text message - sent to a blocked or approved number. It could do from a technical perspective but we believe that it's a could of steps too far and would create real trust issues with the child.

Without wishing to scare anyone there's lots of hard data and media reports showing that almost half (39% in Ireland) of kids are either bullied themselves or know a close friend who has been bullied via their mobile phone. Because of the nature of the device children use them outside of the home and away from their parents protective reach. That increases the risk.

Kidsafe has already been launched with a mobile operator in Ireland and also Singapore. Unfortunately we're not in a position to sell directly to consumers but as is always the case in these circumstances the only way that you'll get the protection for your child is by demanding it. Kidsafe isn't the only solution available to operators (though I do think it's the best!!) but if you want your kids to be protected you should tell them and let them know - call customer service, write an email and ask what they're doing and point out other operators (www.m1.com.sg) and www.three.ie have proactively addressed the situation. Apologies for going on so long - can't help but be passionate.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Seann Birkelund — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:02:40 -0000

Great post. It's nice to see greater attention being paid to what is an ever increasing challenge for today's kids. Norton is the lead sponsor for a special edition Education.com has published on bullying on-line and at a school --- http://www.education.com/to.... There are a number of things parents can do to give their kids the presence of mind to handle tough social situations - both as the bullied and as the bully.

The new Norton product is a major innovation and gives parents the tools they need to begin an active dialogue with their kids and to help protect them from the uglier side of the Internet. I recommend every parent of a school-aged child check out the product when it becomes generally available.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Jim — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:02:15 -0000

Timing couldn't be more perfect, my daughters's elementary school Principal called last night to remind us of the Online Safety meeting for parents and 6th graders that we are having Thursday night.
I will be forwarding this thread to her.
As with most of life's challenges Education and Context are vital.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

The Family Safety Team — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:55:37 -0000

Hi Robert!

This is a good discussion, thanks for taking the time to kick it off. Our product Windows Live Family Safety has a related article for our customers (or future customers) on our blog at http://familysafety.spaces.live.com/blog/cns!5CE47D5D040962D1!1584.entry

Kudos!

- Elizabeth Grigg

Re: Keeping kids online safe

ec — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 13:01:19 -0000

I think that this article and accompanying comments are on the mark. However, educating the children is not the only solution - firstly, because software/hardware safeguards must be in place as well, and moreover the adults need the background and knowledge of the situation at hand to control and/or fight it.

Plus, children aside, I believe that safeguards must be in place for adults as well. Whether it is a monitoring program, filtering software, firewall, or what-have-you, I think that human nature might force even adults to do that which they might know is wrong and should not be done. The only way to safeguard that activity is to have the technology in place to keep them from wrongdoing.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

banana — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:18:01 -0000

Speaking of security, Nice Diggs Robert: Robert's Home

Re: Keeping kids online safe

TechMama — Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:48:57 -0000

I think the first step to protect kids is to educate parents. The problem is the big technology gap between the technology that most parents "grew up" with and how kids use technology these days. Some parents believe that keeping their kids away from technology at home will keep them safe.. Those are the kids that are at the highest risk - because all kids will have access to technology at some place at some time. Beyond that - technology is already apart of how tweens/teens communicate.

So I suggest to all parents to spend time educating themselves then spend time educating their kids. Implement internet security on all computers at home - but also explain why it is important to have security. Try to have computers in public spaces - or if kids have laptops it is important to set timing limitations for internet use.

Parents also need to understand the technology within a computer. Don't think that kids won't figure out how to use the internal video camera to video chat - assume they will and help them understand what is and is NOT appropriate when it comes to video chat (or disable the camera). I could go on, but so happy you got this discussion going.

I also read "Ask Marian" which is a blogger that works for Symantec and talks about online security and safety for kids and families.
http://community.norton.com...

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Zacqary Adam Green — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:10:40 -0000

So parents have to actually talk to their own children now? This is America. Only queers and hippies talk to their kids. Must be that Obama guy's fault. Did you know he's a secret muslin?

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Larry Roth — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:35:10 -0000

Thanks for the article, I agree with all the commenters that say it's important to be involved in your children's lives--not just talking TO them but WITH them.

What I think will be interesting, is the current generation of tweeners and 20-somethings having to explain all their online "appearances" to their kids.
Think about it:
"Mommy, what are Girls Gone Wild?", "Daddy, who is Michael Phelps and what is that you are handing him?"

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Jazz Fan — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 20:59:08 -0000

@RB

Quoth ye: "Young kids learning to use the Internet are the rising stars of the information age and it is our task to guide them without censoring them."

I fully agree with this sentence shy of the last three words. It's a parents' job to censor their child. That's what movie and game ratings are for -- to help parents make informed decisions concerning what their kids see and hear. I know I censor my daughter and she appreciates it. She knows there is evil out there and she wants no part of it.

I worked as a network investigator for a very large ISP, and I can tell you first-hand that there are some very, very evil people out there that want to harm you and your kids. I've seen stuff I wish I could forget. I've families destroyed by what's online, marriages broken, kids exposed to all manner of evil and mischief.

Parents who fail to censor their kids' online activities fail them morally. Full stop. There is no arguing this. Young kids through about 15 should not be allowed to have access to an unfettered internet. Yes, they are the future of tech, but a damaged future holds no promise. I believe the statistics Robert provided are rather conservative based on my own observations in the network security world. It's better to be a little strict and have your kids mad then to have them become a victim.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Jazz Fan — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 20:06:52 -0000

Great post, Robert!

I worked in network security for several years and this topic is near and dear to me, since I have a kid of my own.

What I do is fairly easy and requires no special software:

I have a hardware router and firewall and I do a couple of things. First, I filter access to my home network by MAC address to keep the wi-fi thieves away. Secondly, I take my kid's IP address and I set up a whitelist of websites. She can only visit those sites and no other. I check her computer and the router and firewall on a regular basis to ensure they are doing their respective jobs. I set up my kid's laptop with Ubuntu and I've set up additional filters on her machine to jive with the settings on the router and firewall. Works like a charm. No extra money needed.

Whitelists are far and away better than blackists because they are easier to implement and you don't have to worry about something sneaking in and around your particular set of values you establish for your family. Likewise, your kid can only go where you deem fit. I've helped others with this and it works great. Most hardware routers also have a time restriction function to keep the kids off the net when you don't want them on.

Let's see more security stuff, Robert. I like when you wax poetic on multiple tech topics.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Jennifer McKasson — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:25:56 -0000

I think the software companies are missing the mark. It's great that they get that kids work around any barrier you put up and do more than just talk with creepy old men. However, there is no substitute for a conversation with kids, since they are the ones who will be out there in the danger zone making choices. No software company can simulate it, nor should they. If a parent is seeking a software solution for online child safety and reputation management, the parent doesn't get it.

In four years as a middle school teacher by day and online child decoy by night, I got some great anecdotes from students who didn't know what I did when I went home in the evenings. There was a high schooler who saw Dateline and talked with her mom about it and they agreed that she would be safer if she didn't participate in a particular social networking site. I got the story because she was defending not being a member to a friend of hers with an air of "I can't believe you participate there. That's dangerous." Another time my students found out and told me about the conversations they initiated with their parents. Two years later one reported that she still remembered the safety lessons I imparted to them.

Software companies who are trying to sell something in this space are not serving their customers the best they can, in my opinion. If Norton were to set up an online community for parents to participate in and get tips and guidelines on how to have those conversations with their kids, when to have them and what to do if it's too late... That would be valuable. I'd like to see them add value that way rather than another product that feeds a horrible misconception: that software can take the place of conversation and understanding of the danger. If they wanted to monetize it, offer live webinars to members of the community for a reasonable charge ($5 per IP.)

The dangers to our kids are readily apparent right now, and they are constantly shifting. Right now I see the danger to children as being through parents, actually. Parents see their kids in danger or endangering their future and want to protect them but are ill-informed to do so. In seeking out tools to help them, they get taken prey by software companies promising them their child's safety and security if they buy this product. I hope Norton doesn't fall into this group of predatory companies. That would be a shame.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Karen Diro — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:02:43 -0000

I whole-heartedly agree that talking to your kids about what is and isn't acceptable behavior online is key. As someone with 9 nieces and nephews in their tweens and teens, I was surprised to see what they and some of their friends actually post online -- from potentially embarrassing pictures to rants about other kids -- I found it hard to believe that they didn't understand what some of the consequences of their posts could be. I've spoken to my nieces and nephews about online safety, and in particular, about their online reputation and how that could affect them later. I work at AOL and contribute to the SafetyClicks (http:www.safetyclicks.com) blog about online child safety, and we often stress the importance of parents talking to their kids about appropriate and inappropriate online behavior.

You also make a great point that simply blocking "bad" sites doesn't keep kids safe online. The final Internet Safety Task Force report (http://cyber.law.harvard.ed... reinforces that sentiment in their findings by saying that technology plays a helpful role, but should be combined with parental oversight and education. For years, AOL has advocated that parents use AOL Parental Controls (http://parentalcontrols.aol...) as a way to start a conversation with their kids about online safety. As kids increase their online time, it's more important than ever for parents to educate themselves about the technology their kids are using, and to have open conversations with them about how to keep safe.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Dominic Jones — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:52:30 -0000

"Remember, Google sees all but it is selective about what it sees."

Isn't Gmail still the only major online mail service that does not show the originating IP address in the header? Yes, I think they are and the kids know and love this because it provide anonymity to attack their "friends."

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Offbeatmammal — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:10:00 -0000

as a parent with a 9yo daughter I worry about what she's going to encounter on the web - but I also worry about TV and the mall - so we try to educate and inform and discuss. We use OpenDNS with filters set pretty high at home and an ever expanding hosts file. The PC is in the family area and only approved mail and IM contacts can communicate.

But I wouldn't trust Norton to look after my daughter. My experiences with their software have been less than savory over the years and running their installer is high on my list of things to do when I get a new machine with their cruftware on.

While I hope a convenient and reliable software solution is found (I suspect with an open and transparent peer to peer rating engine) I don't trust a filter to do the whole job any more than I'd let Aibo walk her to school ;)

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Tech_Teacher13 — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:52:03 -0000

Robert,

Not sure if you know why this is the buzz right now, but in the Ed Tech sphere it is because of the 2009 Berkman report on online safety that was just released. It basically confirms what Jody Gibney is saying (Or is this where she got her info?). Check out this blog for the links a synopsis and links:
http://www.dangerouslyirrel...

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Alexander van Elsas — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:02:15 -0000

Hey Robert,

this is where Glubble will help you. We provide parents the tools to support their children discover the web and social networking. Instead of locking children or the computer down, or trying to be the experts for parents, we let parents take the responsibility and build a safe and fun web for their children. This way parents can teach their children to be good citizens in the online world. Glubble is directly integrated into Firefox and comes with safe browsing, search, fun content, twitter, and photo sharing for families, and more.

You can check it out here: www.glubble.com
Or look at this video: http://www.glubble.com/lear...

Sorry for the plug, but it fits the discussion.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Andrew Feinberg — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:41:29 -0000

Robert,

Lest we forget our excellent conversation with Commissioner Jonathan Adelstein of the FCC last summer. I'm surprised you didn't link back to this.

http://www.fastcompany.tv/v...

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Christopher Coulter — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:32:08 -0000

"You blokes look up tight. You should try logging off; it relieves tension" --Ray Tracer. (The Return of the Crimson Binome)

Re: Keeping kids online safe

James — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:24:31 -0000

A timely article for sure.

I completely agree that the need for education for both children and parents is a constant requirement - the question for me is, how can parents protect their kids in the meantime?

More often than not, parents have little real idea of what the children spend their time doing - looking at website lists is, as has already been pointed out, not the whole story - if children want to see most things on the internet then YouTube (to name just one popular site) will have something for sure.

Fact is, children use the internet as a communications tool, be it social networks or instant messenger - THESE are the places kids hang out and therefore old school parental "controls" style tools arent enough - websites are always bad, but the people who use them can be. Is Facebook inherently "bad"? No. Is there a risk of cyberbullying and reputation risk? Yes. Blocking a common website isnt the answer now.

Today, I feel it is more about the appropriateness of communication between children and others, it is about how they represent themselves online, and how they can (safely) learn what to communicate and when. "Parental Controls" are ok when you want to block sites, but the game has moved on and these "control" technologies have not. Just simple keyword matching is too unsophisticated to be used properly in the real world. Kids DO swear a bit - people DO fly Virgin and yes, even live in Scunthorpe...all would trigger keyword matches (!) but does a parent have to know EVERY time a word looks bad (even when, in context, it isnt?) when this irepresents little real danger? The result is "cry-wolf" parental control products that just get ignored after a while.

SMART technology should be able to -

Clever, active technologies that "learn" and understand context as well as content can help be a cornerstone in the family's online "policy" when used alongside sensible education and discussion.

Parents need help, as well as advice, in navigating the online world in order to best keep their children safe - they cannot be realistically expected to become online child safety experts overnight.

There are tools out there that are beginning to help parents achieve this "safe but free" state with their kids - the laudable efforts of the guys at www.imsafer.com show what can be achieved when the problem is properly understood from a parents perspective - and it doesnt have to cost a penny....

Great article and thread.

Re: Keeping kids online safe

Alison — Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:21:13 -0000

Part of the issue is that parents and teachers are both guilty of not teaching their kids how to use the Internet responsibly. Would you let your child who is learning to read pronounce words in an incorrect way? No. The same should be true with Internet literacy. But, the problem goes deeper than that. There is so much information and so much BAD information. There are very few sites that can be trusted. Google spits back result after result, but even I, with a keen eye for differentiating good from bad information have been guilty of relying on information filled with holes and errors. How will our students/children know the difference? I would say that at this time, it's important to find one or two search engines that are safe. Sites like PBS (http://www.pbs.com) and SweetSearch.com (http://www.sweetsearch.com) are the sites I rely on for kids. Both provide adequate information and games and "sweet Search" is hand-picked sites, which are guaranteed to be safe for kids, while providing quality results. A new issue of learning in the future is going to be information literacy...and it's long overdue.