Scobleizer: Can a corporate blogger use the "F-word?"
Michael Cage
· 3 years ago
If you want someone to be authentic, how could you possibly get upset with them for blogging the way they (presumably) speak --- whether that is stuffy and formal or profanity-laced and energetic?
Whether their corporate employers will allow them is another issue ... but I think it's silly for the blogosphere to get upset by it. You can't both want authenticity and then cry when it happens. :-)
anon
· 3 years ago
What I have to say about that is: NO.
There's many more words that corporate bloggers can use instead of the "F-Word".
In fact, I'd actually rather not read a blog entry that has any swearing/inappropiate words in it.
There's many more words that people can spice up their blog with than that.
Alfred Thompson
· 3 years ago
I really don't appreciate such language. To me is suggests immaturity. I lose some respect for someone when I hear them use that sort of langauge. People who think it is "cool" or adds something useful need to grow up or get a better vocabulary. It adds nothing.
paul
· 3 years ago
In Ireland everybody uses the F-expletive all the time - it's fucking freezing - or fuck all - which means there is nothing there at all, but we would never use it in the personaly offensive f-YOU as we do in the good old USA.
Al Billings
· 3 years ago
Can someone tell me what an "inappropriate" word is? My mother can swear like a sailor so it isn't what my mother says... :-)
John C. Welch
· 3 years ago
While I have more problems with the poor usage of profanity than profanity itself, (Really. If you're going to use profanity, do it well. Quantity and quality are NOT the same), there are places it's not appropriate. I won't use it in a preso, period, not appropriate. Other places, sure. But that's me.
Time and place, etc.
Jake
· 3 years ago
This is only news because our society was founded by Puritans, and that neurosis sticks around, in the form of outraged mothers and bizarro hangups about sex. Can anyone actually prove that saying "fuck" actually harms anyone?
Meanwhile, most of my friends in technology curse frequently and often. They're also deeply passionate about technology, so it doesn't surprise me that a technologist at Sun would use that sort of language.
Chris Hanson
· 3 years ago
I think people who are so old-fashioned as to "not appreciate" expletives or who "prefer not to read" them are a dwindling minority. People should feel free to use the full range of expressive language in any medium they wish; what they say, and the skill with which they say it, should be the sole measure of the worth of their message.
In other words, if someone tunes out a message just because it has the word "fuck" in it and their oh-so-sensitive ears (or eyes) can't handle that, they're the fucking idiot. Not the person bearing it.
Mike Cohen
· 3 years ago
When I got my first blue & white G3 in my office (I wasn't blogging at the time) I described it as "fucking fast".
Hugh
· 3 years ago
I won't be using four letter words at the corporate blog I write for Exbiblio simply because I've never heard anyone there swear. If people did f and blind around the office, then I would think it was a true reflection of the corporate culture.
Robert Scoble
· 3 years ago
Mike: there are no good expletives to explain how fast my new MacPro is.
Jeremy Toeman
· 3 years ago
I generally avoid cursing in any typed/printed communications, unless I want it to utterly stand out. I feel it alienates a larger audience than most people think. Also, by taking this approach, whenever I actually do curse, I find it is more impactful.
Sriram Krishnan
· 3 years ago
Any debate on the f-word itself is beside the point.
Blogging is about authenticity - not covering up how you are in real life. If people swear in real life and we're ok with that, it seems hypocritical to get worked up when they use the same language on their blogs.
Tim Bray is just being Tim Bray. If you don't like him or the way he speaks, you can do the blogosphere-equivalent of closing your ears - you can unsubscribe.
joe
· 3 years ago
teehehe - you said a dirty word. tehehe
Rob La Gesse
· 3 years ago
Ah, fuck... I just try not to let the language bother me. My grandfather was a Nazarine Minister. Very strict.
He came back from the movies after watching "Porky's". My dad asked him if it wasn't a bit to "rough" for his tastes and my grandfather replied, "You just ignore that part, and focus on what's important".
Michael Wiley
· 3 years ago
While I use the word regularly in all of its variations, it's inappropriate in a corporate blog.
Nathan M.
· 3 years ago
It's not about Puritans, It's not about authenticity, It's about culture. White Collar professional culture is very similar to what one would call "High Culture", and as such, certain topics, words and idioms are innapropriate.
Whatever the reasons, whatever the history, it is inescapable that profanity is, as a general rule, unaccepatble in public professional communiques (with notable exceptions of course). If you wouldn't use the word at a state dinner or in a job interview, you shouldn't use it while representing a corporate entity.
Anonymous
· 3 years ago
Interestingly, technorati's seeing 35,000 posts with the word "fuck" (or varients) from blogs with a lot of authority.
Words like "fuck" tend to make me want to click on words like "unsubscribe".
Chris
· 3 years ago
It gives a more personal feel to the statement. It hasn't gone through a corporate filter. The blogger is stating their exact thoughts on the product. It's one use of the word fuck.
"Sticks and stones may break my bones but WORDS will never hurt me."
Conor O'Neill
· 3 years ago
Paul's right about us Paddies. I read Tim's post and hadn't noticed the "fuck" until you mentioned it.
As we might say over here "you've little to be worrying about"
Simon Brocklehurst
· 3 years ago
If people don't like it, they should simply unsubscribe; and do so without whining about it.
*Newsflash for people that complain about unimportant stuff like this* No. One. Cares. What. You. Think.
John Dodds
· 3 years ago
I'm not fussed by the language people use but as an attention-getting device it has a very short shelf-life.
I think it's an issue of "raising the stakes." Once you're cussing (instead of being eloquent) to describe something that blows you away, you can't raise the stakes that high again.
Well, without entering into South Park or The Aristocrats territory.
And I also agree that there's a 'tone' issue. If nobody in the corporation cusses in public, and it's a corporate blog, there I think there are fair questions about appropriateness to be asked.
Lord Brar
· 3 years ago
If Fortune and The Economist can print these words in their publication (two of the most reputed ones) then I think that discussing about it is a moot point!
devjunky
· 3 years ago
If swearing is a part of who you are in real life, then I for one would not want that person to write in any other way. Authentic/genuine posts by real people are why I read blogs and not the stuffy traditional "white collar" media.
francine
· 3 years ago
Wow, you got a lot of comments on this. I am a mother. Also a foster mother. When my kids and fosters were little, I explained to them that there was no such thing as a "dirty" word. In fact, the word fuck comes from an old English word for planting (there's that Ph.D. bubbling up in me), and you would be surprised how many currently "dirty" words come from acceptable old ones. (Details on demand).
But I did tell them there were things people didn't want to hear, and part of the fun of life was to figure out who didn't want to hear those words and correctly avoid them. Period.
John Dowdell
· 3 years ago
"If you want someone to be authentic, how could you possibly get upset with them for blogging the way they (presumably) speak — whether that is stuffy and formal or profanity-laced and energetic?"
Speaking, ideally, is a two-way street... it's not just all about the speaker, spouting off whatever little thing happens to be in his head at the moment.
Watch the listener, tune your speech.
Chris
· 3 years ago
Tim's F-Bomb made me look twice at the product. It's been blogged by about a zillion people already, but when he said it was fucking cool, I went, "Really?" And I went to the Sun pages and checked it out.
hugh macleod
· 3 years ago
I frequently use potty-mouth words in my cartoons, but rarely in the text bits of my blog.
neomadness
· 3 years ago
Why alienate a portion of your readers? I agree with Jeremy Toeman and Nathan M. You may feel genuine and open but if you're writing for more than close friends and family, you should take into account the fact that a blog is a conversation.
In the professional world, it's best to leave vulgarities out if you don't want to exclude those who find it distasteful.
We could also debate the Puritan background, I'm sure, but I'm proud to call them my ancestors: industry, love of freedom, self-discipline and selflessness. I wish America could still crown its soul with self-control.
LayZ
· 3 years ago
People that use those types of adjectives to describe something show their lack of education of the english language. You mean to tell me Tim was incapable of using any other word? Perhaps one even more descriptive. It also shows a lack of respect for his audience. ("See how cool I am! I can swear and get away with it!!!")
Silver Smith
· 3 years ago
Those of us who are corporate employees blogging in our personal time do have to be careful about some things that we say, but not this. We have to be careful about mentioning proprietary stuff, or saying things which are directly harmful to the company.
I agree with the others above - authenticity has really created the new communications medium through blogging, and perfectly polished prose is more distrusted as just another PR ploy to manipulate. Corporations should thank their employees who using blogging to put a real, human face on the company.
His blog clearly indicates he doesn't speak officially on behalf of his company -- so, this lite bon mot can't be held against him. If you don't like that kind of language, just don't read his blog. If it's offensive to you, then you're probably not in his target audience anyway.
Wim Plaat
· 3 years ago
It's simply inappropriate and shows a lack of polish, especially in a corporate setting. I doubt that you'll offend anyone by NOT saying it, but you'll simply never hear from the people who you do offend.
As a communicator, we want people to hear our message, but bad language can close the communication channel so fast we don't even realize they've tuned out.
Andrew Sidwell
· 3 years ago
@17: "you shouldn’t use it while representing a corporate entity."
Tim, on every page of his blog, says: "The opinions expressed here are my own, and neither Sun nor any other party necessarily agrees with them." He's not representing a corporate entity, and through what you said may be true, it doesn't apply here.
@37. Hey, that's great. All this says is while they may be his opinions, the use of that type of language simply says they are not well formed.
ioannusdeverani
· 3 years ago
I believe that using the f-word in a blog or during a presentation is unprofessional, especially if one is representing a company. That being said, I agree that profanity attracts hype, and may be plus, sometimes.
Deeby
· 3 years ago
Scoble, your use of the word 'corporate' was, I think, a bit misleading.
Since Tim's blog is hosted on his own server, and predates his employment at Sun, it certainly doesn't seem to fall into the same category as some others, say those hosted at blogs.sun.com....and he's careful to point out that his site contains a mix items from his personal and professional life.
Robert Scoble
· 3 years ago
Deeby: if you can be identified as a corporate employee, as Tim can be, you are doing a corporate blog. Sorry.
It's just the same as if people know who I am and who I work for and I get drunk at a party. I'm still representing the corporation there and can get fired or suffer career consequences because of my actions. (I've seen people fired for stuff like that).
James Craib
· 3 years ago
I'm presently writing a dissertation about the ubiquity of profanity in popular culture. Of course, corporate language gets a mention as well. How do other bloggers feel about the heinous, corporate speech that passes for English in the boardrooms of the world? Isn't that as unacceptable as swearing?
All Comments
Whether their corporate employers will allow them is another issue ... but I think it's silly for the blogosphere to get upset by it. You can't both want authenticity and then cry when it happens. :-)
There's many more words that corporate bloggers can use instead of the "F-Word".
In fact, I'd actually rather not read a blog entry that has any swearing/inappropiate words in it.
There's many more words that people can spice up their blog with than that.
Time and place, etc.
Meanwhile, most of my friends in technology curse frequently and often. They're also deeply passionate about technology, so it doesn't surprise me that a technologist at Sun would use that sort of language.
In other words, if someone tunes out a message just because it has the word "fuck" in it and their oh-so-sensitive ears (or eyes) can't handle that, they're the fucking idiot. Not the person bearing it.
Blogging is about authenticity - not covering up how you are in real life. If people swear in real life and we're ok with that, it seems hypocritical to get worked up when they use the same language on their blogs.
Tim Bray is just being Tim Bray. If you don't like him or the way he speaks, you can do the blogosphere-equivalent of closing your ears - you can unsubscribe.
He came back from the movies after watching "Porky's". My dad asked him if it wasn't a bit to "rough" for his tastes and my grandfather replied, "You just ignore that part, and focus on what's important".
Whatever the reasons, whatever the history, it is inescapable that profanity is, as a general rule, unaccepatble in public professional communiques (with notable exceptions of course). If you wouldn't use the word at a state dinner or in a job interview, you shouldn't use it while representing a corporate entity.
http://technorati.com/search/fuck?language=n&am...
"Sticks and stones may break my bones but WORDS will never hurt me."
As we might say over here "you've little to be worrying about"
*Newsflash for people that complain about unimportant stuff like this* No. One. Cares. What. You. Think.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=JLvqrWz78bo
Well, without entering into South Park or The Aristocrats territory.
And I also agree that there's a 'tone' issue. If nobody in the corporation cusses in public, and it's a corporate blog, there I think there are fair questions about appropriateness to be asked.
But I did tell them there were things people didn't want to hear, and part of the fun of life was to figure out who didn't want to hear those words and correctly avoid them. Period.
Speaking, ideally, is a two-way street... it's not just all about the speaker, spouting off whatever little thing happens to be in his head at the moment.
Watch the listener, tune your speech.
In the professional world, it's best to leave vulgarities out if you don't want to exclude those who find it distasteful.
We could also debate the Puritan background, I'm sure, but I'm proud to call them my ancestors: industry, love of freedom, self-discipline and selflessness. I wish America could still crown its soul with self-control.
I agree with the others above - authenticity has really created the new communications medium through blogging, and perfectly polished prose is more distrusted as just another PR ploy to manipulate. Corporations should thank their employees who using blogging to put a real, human face on the company.
His blog clearly indicates he doesn't speak officially on behalf of his company -- so, this lite bon mot can't be held against him. If you don't like that kind of language, just don't read his blog. If it's offensive to you, then you're probably not in his target audience anyway.
As a communicator, we want people to hear our message, but bad language can close the communication channel so fast we don't even realize they've tuned out.
Tim, on every page of his blog, says: "The opinions expressed here are my own, and neither Sun nor any other party necessarily agrees with them." He's not representing a corporate entity, and through what you said may be true, it doesn't apply here.
http://www.funlol.com/funpages/historyoffword.html
Since Tim's blog is hosted on his own server, and predates his employment at Sun, it certainly doesn't seem to fall into the same category as some others, say those hosted at blogs.sun.com....and he's careful to point out that his site contains a mix items from his personal and professional life.
It's just the same as if people know who I am and who I work for and I get drunk at a party. I'm still representing the corporation there and can get fired or suffer career consequences because of my actions. (I've seen people fired for stuff like that).